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	<title>Comments for Feminist Fred</title>
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	<link>http://www.feministfred.com</link>
	<description>A place for men to learn about feminism.</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 07 Sep 2008 17:30:05 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>Comment on A Rare Post About Femininity by Fred</title>
		<link>http://www.feministfred.com/archives/71#comment-487</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Sep 2008 14:49:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministfred.com/?p=71#comment-487</guid>
		<description>My wife is a red head with near to no body hair at all. Yet she still shaves her legs because she's afraid people will see her tiny, invisible hair. 

I was using shorthand for clothing that means nothing feminine, of course, but have since realized that we have different upper body issues that need to be addressed for comfort, too. Some of the looser parts of our bodies like to be cradled or supported when we need to move around a lot.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My wife is a red head with near to no body hair at all. Yet she still shaves her legs because she&#8217;s afraid people will see her tiny, invisible hair. </p>
<p>I was using shorthand for clothing that means nothing feminine, of course, but have since realized that we have different upper body issues that need to be addressed for comfort, too. Some of the looser parts of our bodies like to be cradled or supported when we need to move around a lot.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Rare Post About Femininity by belenen</title>
		<link>http://www.feministfred.com/archives/71#comment-486</link>
		<dc:creator>belenen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Sep 2008 13:44:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministfred.com/?p=71#comment-486</guid>
		<description>btw I syndicated you on LJ so I could easily keep up with you ;-)

http://syndicated.livejournal.com/feministfred/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>btw I syndicated you on LJ so I could easily keep up with you <img src='http://www.feministfred.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p><a href="http://syndicated.livejournal.com/feministfred/" rel="nofollow">http://syndicated.livejournal.com/feministfred/</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on A Rare Post About Femininity by belenen</title>
		<link>http://www.feministfred.com/archives/71#comment-485</link>
		<dc:creator>belenen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Sep 2008 13:42:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministfred.com/?p=71#comment-485</guid>
		<description>I haven't shaved in years -- and nobody ever stares.  That fear comes from a habit of comparing.  If I go around looking at all other women and rating them in comparison to myself, then I will expect them to do the same to me, and I will see that in every glance.  However, if I appreciate everyone as beautiful for being unique, then I will expect the same admiration from others, and when people glance at me that is what I will see.  

As far as 'feminine' accessories, I've got the short hair, short nails, hairy legs, hairy pits, no fake-natural makeup like concealer (if I've got a pimple, I'm not going to hide it because WOMEN GET THEM TOO) -- if I wear makeup it is wildly colorful and hides no 'flaw', no hair products, no bras, no girdles or control-top anything, no fancy shoes (I have one pair of tennis shoes which is all I ever wear).

I've been tempted to hide my shape and wear only that which is androgynous, but I find those clothes uncomfortable and inexpressive.  I decided that just like I should not let ideas of 'femininity' decide what I SHOULD wear, I should also not let them decide what I SHOULDN'T wear.  So I wear strappy tops that give me a little support so that I can comfortably go braless, and most of the time I wear skirts.  I think that my hairiness and mismatched socks and tennis shoes contradict the 'femininity' of the skirt enough to give a categorizer a headache.  Not to mention that pants made to fit my size and hips are, in my mind, more 'feminine' than skirts, because of the restrictiveness of them.

On jeans -- they're considered androgynous but they are NOT.  Most women who wear them wear tight-enough-to-be-a-corset, slim-you-down, restrict-your-movement-and-breathing jeans.  Men wear comfortable jeans that don't squeeze anything -- these are very very very different items that have in common only the fact that they are made from denim.  Now if women wore 'men's' (aka comfortable &#38; useful) jeans, that would be a step up.  But the fact is that women's fashion tends toward anything that restricts or cripples (such as high heels), and jeans are a very strong example of this.  I used to wear jeans so tight they made me numb from bellybutton to knees -- no more.  I made myself a promise years ago that I will never again wear restrictive or uncomfortable clothing.  I think that if women simply changed to that which is comfortable, most women would have to change out at least 3/4ths of their wardrobe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I haven&#8217;t shaved in years &#8212; and nobody ever stares.  That fear comes from a habit of comparing.  If I go around looking at all other women and rating them in comparison to myself, then I will expect them to do the same to me, and I will see that in every glance.  However, if I appreciate everyone as beautiful for being unique, then I will expect the same admiration from others, and when people glance at me that is what I will see.  </p>
<p>As far as &#8216;feminine&#8217; accessories, I&#8217;ve got the short hair, short nails, hairy legs, hairy pits, no fake-natural makeup like concealer (if I&#8217;ve got a pimple, I&#8217;m not going to hide it because WOMEN GET THEM TOO) &#8212; if I wear makeup it is wildly colorful and hides no &#8216;flaw&#8217;, no hair products, no bras, no girdles or control-top anything, no fancy shoes (I have one pair of tennis shoes which is all I ever wear).</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve been tempted to hide my shape and wear only that which is androgynous, but I find those clothes uncomfortable and inexpressive.  I decided that just like I should not let ideas of &#8216;femininity&#8217; decide what I SHOULD wear, I should also not let them decide what I SHOULDN&#8217;T wear.  So I wear strappy tops that give me a little support so that I can comfortably go braless, and most of the time I wear skirts.  I think that my hairiness and mismatched socks and tennis shoes contradict the &#8216;femininity&#8217; of the skirt enough to give a categorizer a headache.  Not to mention that pants made to fit my size and hips are, in my mind, more &#8216;feminine&#8217; than skirts, because of the restrictiveness of them.</p>
<p>On jeans &#8212; they&#8217;re considered androgynous but they are NOT.  Most women who wear them wear tight-enough-to-be-a-corset, slim-you-down, restrict-your-movement-and-breathing jeans.  Men wear comfortable jeans that don&#8217;t squeeze anything &#8212; these are very very very different items that have in common only the fact that they are made from denim.  Now if women wore &#8216;men&#8217;s&#8217; (aka comfortable &amp; useful) jeans, that would be a step up.  But the fact is that women&#8217;s fashion tends toward anything that restricts or cripples (such as high heels), and jeans are a very strong example of this.  I used to wear jeans so tight they made me numb from bellybutton to knees &#8212; no more.  I made myself a promise years ago that I will never again wear restrictive or uncomfortable clothing.  I think that if women simply changed to that which is comfortable, most women would have to change out at least 3/4ths of their wardrobe.</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Rare Post About Femininity by belenen</title>
		<link>http://www.feministfred.com/archives/71#comment-484</link>
		<dc:creator>belenen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 01 Sep 2008 13:40:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministfred.com/?p=71#comment-484</guid>
		<description>"The argument that you’re just as liable to be raped dressed up as dressed down"

not only does it not make sense, it implies that the only reason to dress one way or another would be to avoid rape.  Yes, rape is a very real issue that affects every part of our lives, but that does not mean we should allow the threat of it to affect our every decision.  If none of us stand against the flow then we can build no strength against the rapist mentality -- the idea that by wearing clothing that fits or does not fit the ideal, we are giving consent to be used sexually.  When we catch ourselves living in fear of rape, we need to try to find a way to break free of it; if we don't, we are giving away our power.  If we allow rapists to dictate our clothing choices, we are allowing them to invade our lives even when they are not violating us sexually.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The argument that you’re just as liable to be raped dressed up as dressed down&#8221;</p>
<p>not only does it not make sense, it implies that the only reason to dress one way or another would be to avoid rape.  Yes, rape is a very real issue that affects every part of our lives, but that does not mean we should allow the threat of it to affect our every decision.  If none of us stand against the flow then we can build no strength against the rapist mentality &#8212; the idea that by wearing clothing that fits or does not fit the ideal, we are giving consent to be used sexually.  When we catch ourselves living in fear of rape, we need to try to find a way to break free of it; if we don&#8217;t, we are giving away our power.  If we allow rapists to dictate our clothing choices, we are allowing them to invade our lives even when they are not violating us sexually.</p>
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		<title>Comment on How male supremacy oppresses humans with male parts by Fred</title>
		<link>http://www.feministfred.com/archives/46#comment-483</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Aug 2008 12:55:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministfred.com/?p=46#comment-483</guid>
		<description>Excellent points, Shiny. I used to see all my problems with men solely from the standpoint of my dislike for competition, since I neither wanted to be a loser or a winner. Now that women have opened up my eyes to the oppression they feel, whether they choose to deny it or not, it's added a whole new dimension to how I look at my faults and tendencies. But the essential quest to dominate is the hallmark of masculinity, which puts men in constant competition with everything in an endless and ultimately doomed contest.

It's why I reject sexualities based on dominance and submission. I can easily see the appeal but the reality of it has always horrified me. The simplicity of giving up responsibility for arousal and turning to forcible methods to get there is a natural outgrowth of our sick uber-sexual world view these days.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent points, Shiny. I used to see all my problems with men solely from the standpoint of my dislike for competition, since I neither wanted to be a loser or a winner. Now that women have opened up my eyes to the oppression they feel, whether they choose to deny it or not, it&#8217;s added a whole new dimension to how I look at my faults and tendencies. But the essential quest to dominate is the hallmark of masculinity, which puts men in constant competition with everything in an endless and ultimately doomed contest.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s why I reject sexualities based on dominance and submission. I can easily see the appeal but the reality of it has always horrified me. The simplicity of giving up responsibility for arousal and turning to forcible methods to get there is a natural outgrowth of our sick uber-sexual world view these days.</p>
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		<title>Comment on How male supremacy oppresses humans with male parts by Shiny</title>
		<link>http://www.feministfred.com/archives/46#comment-482</link>
		<dc:creator>Shiny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Aug 2008 05:43:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministfred.com/?p=46#comment-482</guid>
		<description>Although I think men do get off on the power of oppressing others, I don't believe that is the only motivation for doing it.  Power in whatever form it manifests (physical strength, wealth, social status, etc.) is the essence of masculinity, and it is how men relate to each other.  Women are just a form of currency in this system, no different than a big house or a hot car.  That's why a woman's beauty and sexuality are so highly regulated, so a man can possess her and demonstrate his power; any woman who does not conform to those standards has lower "value" (e.g. prostitutes and "sluts").

Men are in competition only with other men, so they reject all identification with women.  I have heard women say countless times that their husbands/boyfriends are never reassured by them.  Men look elsewhere for validation because women are "less than" they are (thus their opinions are worthless), and men's only recourse is to look for a new toy with which to impress other men.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although I think men do get off on the power of oppressing others, I don&#8217;t believe that is the only motivation for doing it.  Power in whatever form it manifests (physical strength, wealth, social status, etc.) is the essence of masculinity, and it is how men relate to each other.  Women are just a form of currency in this system, no different than a big house or a hot car.  That&#8217;s why a woman&#8217;s beauty and sexuality are so highly regulated, so a man can possess her and demonstrate his power; any woman who does not conform to those standards has lower &#8220;value&#8221; (e.g. prostitutes and &#8220;sluts&#8221;).</p>
<p>Men are in competition only with other men, so they reject all identification with women.  I have heard women say countless times that their husbands/boyfriends are never reassured by them.  Men look elsewhere for validation because women are &#8220;less than&#8221; they are (thus their opinions are worthless), and men&#8217;s only recourse is to look for a new toy with which to impress other men.</p>
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		<title>Comment on How male supremacy oppresses humans with male parts by Freida</title>
		<link>http://www.feministfred.com/archives/46#comment-480</link>
		<dc:creator>Freida</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Aug 2008 16:07:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministfred.com/?p=46#comment-480</guid>
		<description>Good drug analogy.  I would add (as you already implied) that the more you get, the more you actually need in order to get the same high.  That's how it is with porn as well (as you know from that book, Getting Off).

I wouldn't be surprised if Hefner IS happy, although in an Ignorance-Is-Bliss sort of way.

Men are harmed in ways the MRA's cannot begin to understand.  They are basically arguing for the right to own slaves.

Thanks so much for offering to coddle the dudes, so Twisy doesn't have to.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good drug analogy.  I would add (as you already implied) that the more you get, the more you actually need in order to get the same high.  That&#8217;s how it is with porn as well (as you know from that book, Getting Off).</p>
<p>I wouldn&#8217;t be surprised if Hefner IS happy, although in an Ignorance-Is-Bliss sort of way.</p>
<p>Men are harmed in ways the MRA&#8217;s cannot begin to understand.  They are basically arguing for the right to own slaves.</p>
<p>Thanks so much for offering to coddle the dudes, so Twisy doesn&#8217;t have to.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Book for feminists with male parts by Freida</title>
		<link>http://www.feministfred.com/archives/43#comment-478</link>
		<dc:creator>Freida</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Aug 2008 18:31:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministfred.com/?p=43#comment-478</guid>
		<description>Oops, I could be mistaken.  Maybe by "just finished" you meant reading, not writing.  Sorry.  I hope I am mistaken, and there is more than one empathetic male in the world.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oops, I could be mistaken.  Maybe by &#8220;just finished&#8221; you meant reading, not writing.  Sorry.  I hope I am mistaken, and there is more than one empathetic male in the world.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Book for feminists with male parts by Fred</title>
		<link>http://www.feministfred.com/archives/43#comment-477</link>
		<dc:creator>Fred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Aug 2008 18:29:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministfred.com/?p=43#comment-477</guid>
		<description>Freida, I'm sorry, but I have never written a book myself. I'm just some random person who hates oppression. Thanks for thinking so highly of me, though!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Freida, I&#8217;m sorry, but I have never written a book myself. I&#8217;m just some random person who hates oppression. Thanks for thinking so highly of me, though!</p>
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		<title>Comment on Book for feminists with male parts by Freida</title>
		<link>http://www.feministfred.com/archives/43#comment-476</link>
		<dc:creator>Freida</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Aug 2008 16:50:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.feministfred.com/?p=43#comment-476</guid>
		<description>Oh, Fred (Robert).  I had a feeling TP was you.  I bought your book, but am having a hard time reading it, because I hate porn so much and sometimes think I should remain in blissful ignorance.  I think about injustice a lot, and probably seem like a feminist lacking a sense of humor.

I also believe men would be better off without oppressing women, but in ways most of them cannot currently understand.  It takes a completely different mindset to appreciate how equality for all is better than being at the top of the heap.  I've noticed that a lot of men have made this leap when it comes to racism, yet they fail to realize that sexism is just as wrong, and just as harmful to everyone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, Fred (Robert).  I had a feeling TP was you.  I bought your book, but am having a hard time reading it, because I hate porn so much and sometimes think I should remain in blissful ignorance.  I think about injustice a lot, and probably seem like a feminist lacking a sense of humor.</p>
<p>I also believe men would be better off without oppressing women, but in ways most of them cannot currently understand.  It takes a completely different mindset to appreciate how equality for all is better than being at the top of the heap.  I&#8217;ve noticed that a lot of men have made this leap when it comes to racism, yet they fail to realize that sexism is just as wrong, and just as harmful to everyone.</p>
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